Originally by: Wheya

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I am an Amarr roleplayer flying Amarr ships only.

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Originally by: Nyxus

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Not all Amarr ships are bad. But we have a preponderance of ships that just.....lack in comparison to other racial ships. Some are ship issues, some are weapon issues, some are underpowered bonus issues, some are a result of ammo imbalance, etc. Let's take a look at some of them.

• Passive Tanking Boost: Yes we needed a boost to tanking. But now, almost every ship in the game besides Caldari and some tempests passive armor tank. Where before 60% EM resist was manageable, it is common for armor tanks to have 75%+ resists to armor while not specifically kitting out to defend against Amarr.


• Ammo Distribution Imbalance: This goes hand in hand with the above issue. Range should be an advantage to lasers, especially in mid-long range. While other races have Carbonized Lead 12Exp/12Kin and Iron 12Kin/8Therm Amarr have Radio 20EM. Crystals should have an equitable EM/Therm split like all the other races, ESPECIALLY considering the boosts to passive tanking.


• Some gun fitting needs are too high: Medium Beam Lasers, Heavy Pulses - some of the Amarr weapons are WAY harder to fit than the racial Contemporaries.
• Some Amarr ships have the same grid/cpu layout as other racial ships that have weapons that are MUCH easier to mount: Whey does a crusader and claw both have 40pg base when the Crusader weapons are so much harder to fit?? Why does the Thrasher and Coercer have the same? Why are the Maller/Ruppie/Thorax so close in grid when lasers require so much grid more to fit? Why can a Mega fit a full rack of Neuts without a grid mod yet then Apoc can not fit a full rack of Tachys?


• Some Amarr non-damage bonuses need a boost: With stacking 5% per level of Armor resists isn't really enough to make a difference. It needs to be increased to at least 7.5% or make it not applicable to the stacking rules. Right now a brutix can tank just as well as a Prophecy yet has MUCH more damage potential and more mids and dronebay. Maller has the same problem. The "better" tanking just isn't appreciable in any noticeable way. The Apoc needs to lose a mostly useless cap bonus for an Armor Resist bonus as well. The Non-damage bonuses often need a larger percentage to be considered usefull. The recent brutix boost is a prime example of this.


• Lack of Mids, less useful lows: Mids largely determine PvP usefullness to some extent. Amarr have 2 ships with 1 mid, and many with only 2. In return we have (sometimes) an extra low that is much less useful overall. A Taranis with more mids and a dronebay is more useful than a Crusader becuase it does 90% of what a Sader can do, has a dronebay and an extra mid as well. Same with the Enyo and Retri.


• Useless ships, Khanid without a clue: WTH is an Omen supposed to be good at? If it's going to be a gunboat, let it do a crapload of damage and fit big guns. Right now like the Augorer its mostly useless. Khanid designs are 50/50 and therefore MASSIVELY inferior in the dps department. Let them spew missiles and armor tank. It's an interesting niche and provides DESPERATELY needed variety to Amarr ships. Right now Khanid ships are 90% inferior to other ships of thier class. Remember variety = interest = subscription retention.

So this isn't comprehensive, but I think it's most of them. Individually not so large but HUGE in sum total.

Nyxus

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Originally by: Meridius

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Originally by: Spartan239

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oh and if you wanna compare vaga dps might wanna do 5x220's or 5xd180's because noone would fit that setup so I cant see why it means anything (imo posting unviable setups is just pointless)

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It does like 2% less dps with 220mm's.

Oh noes.

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Originally by: twit brent

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my tach geddon will blow up any ship faster than a railtron can by a long way unless that ship is set for just EM + thermal tanking.

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Originally by: Double TaP

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Originally by: Imperial Coercion

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Edited by: Imperial Coercion on 17/06/2006 10:46:15

Originally by: twit brent

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my tach geddon will blow up any ship faster than a railtron can by a long way unless that ship is set for just EM + thermal tanking.

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Pffft. I had an encounter with a Raven here the otherday. Range was about 100-ish. I got the raven to 60% shield when I was at 50% armour and had to warp out(because with tachs you cant even fit a repair module. Raven used cruise missiles and I used auroras.

And yes, I got all gunnery skills maxed out on top of bs lv5.

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Oh so your tier one ship didn't beat a tier 2 ship that can mount a great tank?

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Originally by: The Gate

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Originally by: Serj Darek

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Originally by: Ganandorf

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2 large reppers = 2 large reppers, doesn't matter crap if you're in an apoc or a megathron or a tempest, they tank the same so apoc isn't a good tanker

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Except that the Apoc has the most armor of the mentioned bs:s?

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What good is a little extra armor when your opponent can do a hell of alot more damage than you can do ?

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Originally by: El Ponja

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i really hope so, im just worried that no dev has replied to this thread yet

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Originally by: dabster

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People who keeps on chanting "Matar can change damage types", seriously cant be flying Matari themselves. This is the most moot and over-exaggurated 'advantage' there is.

It has absolute zero meaning in actual pvp 99% of the times, stop mentioning it ffs. Also, 10 seconds reload isnt exactly great you know.

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Originally by: Exogene

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No ammo or reload...lame excuse which is very very irrelevant if you are doing crap damage

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Originally by: Amanda Zeherah

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MY 9 month old character sucks...THIS GAME SUCKS!!![/b]

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Originally by: Mahavy Seth

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Fitting 4 energy neutralizer do not allow you to do more damage but hit enemies even more hard I think

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Originally by: Jenny Spitfire

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Originally by: Spaced Skunk

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I cant think of a way to make amarr balance...you've got a problem CCP.

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Change basic shield and armour resists from one size fits all to racial.

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Originally by: Cathandra

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Wow.. 36 pages of pure "WAAAAAAAH PLX MAEK R STUF MOR UBER STRONG SO WE CAN PWN ALL OR WE GUNA CRYYYYYYYYYYYYY"

Somebody call the waaaaaaaaaaaaaaambulance

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Originally by: Sarmaul

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Compare pulses to blasters and autocannons please.

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Originally by: Nifel

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Go full gank with lasers or go full tank with projectiles/missiles.

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Originally by: Altai Saker

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2006.07.02 16:29:43 combat Your Dual Light Beam Laser II perfectly strikes Naroa [3B-IX] *Capsule, wrecking for 39.1 damage.

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Originally by: Sarmaul

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Think before you type.

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Originally by: Kardim

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if you spend a year or two training up a race for it to work well and it doesnt then no its not just a game, its a job.

you only take the skills to lvl 5 cause the hope that well maybe that extra lil bit will let me win a fight.... then find out you wont, bit depressing

anyways ive about abandoned amarr for any pvp and most npc, training caldari now and when i get to raven i can be a god like everyone else (npc atleast)

sigh

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Originally by: Sonorra Baki

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Could someone with some more time than me on their hands, copy the best posts (best suggestions, best supported facts etc) out from this topic, and into a new "summary topic" ?

The new topic should be consisting of a bulleted list, with links to the original posts.

Ive seen it done before, with the blaster thread i think, and it was applauded by a dev for summarizing all the good points.

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Originally by: MacQueen

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Why our Emperor dont have a clone ?? He got assasinated. If not, he may give order to fix up Amarr ships.

Ah, well, it's just another reason why Amarr is going down, we lost our Emperor !!!

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Originally by: Lisento Slaven

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Since when does the Apoc suck for ratting?

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Originally by: Caya

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Will i be the only one after 44 pages saying, dont touch my amarr. They r more than fine and if they get boost i can already smell moaning from other sides.

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Originally by: Dixon

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Quote:

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This is eve, that part of eve that is gone, that you did not experience and probably will never do, unless you move to china

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Oh, I'm sorry my mighty wise amarrian lord. I shouldn't dare question you and your moronic wishes for an Amarrian droneboat...

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Originally by: eLLioTT wave

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i have now decided to keep posting here until we get to 50 and receiver our dev response.

Come on we are only a page and a bit away!

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Originally by: Matrix Aran

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But someone will figure out that they are to be used for different things and everyone will be happy.

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Originally by: madaluap

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But really you want a smartbomb bonus??

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Originally by: Ather Ialeas

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gettting webbed from 20-30km and then being forced to watch when a golden lump comes towards you slowly...and when it finally gets in range, *BLAM* *BLAM* *BLAM* *BLAM* *BLAM*.

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Originally by: Cosmo Raata

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Daily Bump--

Page 50 coming soon!!

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Originally by: Andreask14

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Edited by: Andreask14 on 02/08/2006 12:20:05
Fun fact:

The stacking nerf hit amarr the most, since they rely so heavily on one fitting style for each ship, either you tank it, or you gank it, try both and the tank fights with your guns for the ammo.

What am i supposed to put in the 8 lows of a geddon when more than 3 heatsinks wont work?

Also, the Coercer is funny, with adv. weapon upgrades 4 you still have to fit all 4 low slots with RCUs so you can fit a full rack of medium beams in the highs.

Amarrs are the race with the most limited ships fitting wise and thus tacticaly. As such, the stacking nerf hits them hardest, scince every compromise just makes their ships worse.

All amarrian ships were designed to be stuborn and NOT compromise and firepower for tank or vice-verse if you wanted best performance, the drawback was the lack in verstility and self-sustainment, obviously.

Sadly, the stacking nerf has totally ruined the uncompromising nature of most amarrian ships, that is why their few actually versatile ones are now their best, the ones with the most mid-slots.

Honestly, what is a geddon suppoed to put in the 8 low slots when only 3 heatsinks work?

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Originally by: Jocelyn Fernos

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Amarr ships/guns needs a serious look over. We trade versatility for damage or tank, atelast we should do extremly good damage which we dont or we should armor tank like no other which we also dont do.

As it stands now i sadly dont really see a reason for flying amarr ships since the two things we should shine on, other races and their ships do much better, even at the same time in some cases.

How to fix this? Perhaps introduce true racial skills togheter with looking over the amarr ships/weapons. An "amarr" skill that only amarr pilots can have. Perhaps it could give a bonus to armor repair/hardners resistances and/or bonus to lasers, e.g damage bonus, rof bonus, falloff bonus. With this an amarrian pilot would allways be better with his racial ship/guns vs an other race pilot with the same ship/equipment. And this would o/c be done for all the races.

Just had to write something, please correct me if im totaly wrong, but that is the impression i have got from playing this game as an amarr only pilot for a year and reading threads like this.

Thoughts?

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Originally by: Wodin Drukvik

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Originally by: Cosmo Raata

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Yes, a Vampoc was a great option, right up to the point the devs said they are going to nerf nos, yet another topic amarr need to post & fight on.

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To be fair, if there's any ship that has the fitting space to mount neutralizers, it's the Apoc.

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